Has anyone changed their fluid to a performance brake fluid such as Motul 660?

Is it completely compatable w/ the factory fluid?

If used in a brake flush machine would it be completely compatable if mixed w/ standard Dot 3?

Has anyone changed their fluid to a performance brake fluid such as Motul 660?

Is it completely compatable w/ the factory fluid?

If used in a brake flush machine would it be completely compatable if mixed w/ standard Dot 3?

They tell you to try to remove the old dot3 fluid as much as possible then fill with the new. It won't hurt the seals or anything but the effectiveness (boiling point) can be adversly affected by the presence of the dot3 in the system.

I have the Motul RBF600 in my car now.:cool:

So basically drain, flush with the 600, then fill, purge and rock on :D

So basically drain, flush with the 600, then fill, purge and rock on :D

Exactly ,especially the rock on part! http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/21-4.gif

I was going to have my dealer flush my fluid before I went to the track each time I go. He was concerned though that if I put in different fluid it would not be compatible with his machine?

How much and where can you get a basic power bleeding machine?

I know its not that hard to do manually, I even normally use a vauum to bleed, but it seems like it would be much nicer to just break the bleeder at each wheel and let the machine do the work?

I was going to have my dealer flush my fluid before I went to the track each time I go. He was concerned though that if I put in different fluid it would not be compatible with his machine?

How much and where can you get a basic power bleeding machine?

I know its not that hard to do manually, I even normally use a vauum to bleed, but it seems like it would be much nicer to just break the bleeder at each wheel and let the machine do the work?

The problem with using a power bleeder mounted on the master cylinder (with dot 4 racing fluid)is the increased risk of getting air compressed into the fluid thereby increasing the presence of moisture . This will drasticly reduce the efficency of the fluid by lowering the boiling point of the fluid at least by 1/3rd.

I read an article about this a while back I'll see if I can dig it up.

The problem with using a power bleeder mounted on the master cylinder (with dot 4 racing fluid)is the increased risk of getting air compressed into the fluid thereby increasing the presence of moisture . This will drasticly reduce the efficency of the fluid by lowering the boiling point of the fluid at least by 1/3rd.

I read an article about this a while back I'll see if I can dig it up.

Even if used correctly??

Even if used correctly??

Good question

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/edit.gif according to what the article says the answer is NO unless you use one that seperates the air source from the fluid source by a rubber diaphram.

See the article in post#9



Brake Fluid:

Motul® RBF 600 has a very high
dry boiling point of 593F and a wet boiling point of 420F.
RBF 600 Super Hi-Temp racing brake fluid was developed for high heat and the extreme pressure demands of professional racing. RBF 600 has a low viscosity blended with unmatched performance in the most extreme conditions for minimal hydroscopic effect and very low compressibility. Motul® RBF 600 will give solid pedal feel, great response, super high heat protection and maximum life.

Available by the bottle, in six-packs or economical 12 bottle cases.
Brake Fluid Application Guide and Tips :

Due to the extreme operating temperatures of a high performance brake system, standard 'off-the-shelf' brake fluids are not recommended. Of critical importance in determining a fluids ability to handle high temperature applications is the Dry Boiling Point and compressibility.
The Dry Boiling Point is the temperature at which a brake fluid will boil in its virgin non-contaminated state. The highest temperature Dry Boiling Point available in a DOT 3 fluid is 572 F

The Wet Boiling Point is the temperature a brake fluid will boil after it has been fully saturated with moisture. The DOT 3 requirement for wet boiling point is a minimum temperature of 284 F.

There are many ways for moisture to enter your brake system. Condensation from regular use, washing the vehicle and humidity are the most common, with little hope of prevention. Glycol based DOT 3 & 4 & 5.1 fluids are hygroscopic; they absorb brake system moisture, and over time the boiling point is gradually reduced.

We do not recommend using DOT 5 fluid in any racing applications. DOT 5 fluid is not hygroscopic, so as moisture enters the system, it is not absorbed by the fluid, and results in beads of moisture moving through the brake line, collecting in the calipers . It is not uncommon to have caliper temperatures exceed 200 F, and at 212 F, this collected moisture will boil causing vapor lock and system failure. Additionally, DOT 5 fluid is highly compressible due to aeration and foaming under normal braking conditions, providing a spongy brake feel. DOT 5 fluid is best suited for show car applications where its anti-corrosion and paint friendly characteristics are important.

Whenever you add fresh fluid to your existing system (never mix fluids of different DOT classifications), it immediately becomes contaminated, lowering the boiling point of the new fluid.
For maximum performance, start with the highest Dry Boiling Point available, flush the system completely, and flush it regularly, especially after severe temperatures have been experienced.

Brake system capacities vary on differing vehicles. Typically 2 Pints (or approximately 1 Liter) should be sufficient to completely flush the old fluid and replace with new. We recommend 4 Pints or 2 Liters of Fluid to be certain that your system is completely flushed of old fluid- and this also allows for some extra fluid to spare.

I found the article here is a part of it.
Pressure bleeding do's and don'ts

Pressure bleeding on its own is not necessarily a bad thing, but there are several steps one must take to ensure that the bleed event will result in an air-free brake system.

When we talk about pressure bleeding, we are referring to the process in which we pour our brake fluid into a pressure vessel, hook up a pressure source, and run the now pressurized fluid directly into the master cylinder reservoir. One by one the caliper bleeder screws are opened to allow the pressurized fluid to flow through the system until all of the old fluid has been purged. Simple, right?

Well yes, but beware of imitations – not all pressure bleeders are created equal. The professional units (the type you can consider using) separate the pressurized brake fluid from the pressure source (air) using a flexible rubber diaphragm. In this fashion, the pressurized air is kept from forcing its way into the fluid. As we all know, air and fluid should be kept as far apart as possible.

This brings us to the imitations. There seem to be a rash of products available lately that claim to be pressure brake bleeders at a fraction of the cost of the professional units. Like most things that sound too good to be true, well, it’s exactly that.

Like the professional units, these imitations contain a pressure vessel into which new brake fluid is poured. However, in order to pressurize the fluid, an integral pump handle is cycled to build the pressure inside the vessel without any measures taken to separate the pressurized air from the fluid. For those of you who have ever bought a $19.95 do-it-yourself potted plant and bug sprayer from Home Depot you get the idea.
Of course, having pressurized air in contact with the brake fluid will certainly force the fluid through the system just as effectively as the high-zoot professional unit, but as an added bonus we are stuffing air into the brake fluid at the same time. Talk about an unwanted surprise!
While it may not be visible to the naked eye (air can actually entrain itself in the fluid as to be visually undetectable) it’s there right along with all of the nasty moisture trapped inside of it. This of course begs the question: if you are stuffing air and water contaminated fluid into your brake system, why even bother bleeding it in the first place?

Naturally there will be those who argue that the amount of air in question is not important enough to worry about, but think about this for a moment: nearly every automotive manufacturer stores their bulk brake fluid in large containers which are subjected to a constant VACUUM. Talk about an expensive process! If just storing your fluid under regular atmospheric conditions isn’t good enough to keep air and water out, just imagine what shoving 30psi worth of compressed air on top of it is doing.
The professional units can cost hundreds of dollars, and for good reason; unfortunately the cost keeps them beyond the reach of most of us normal folks. Your best bet is probably to get back in the driver’s seat and begin stroking the pedal with your foot again, but ultimately the choice is yours.
Here's the link for the whole article. http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_brakefluid_1a.shtml

I was going to have my dealer flush my fluid before I went to the track each time I go. He was concerned though that if I put in different fluid it would not be compatible with his machine?

How much and where can you get a basic power bleeding machine?

I know its not that hard to do manually, I even normally use a vauum to bleed, but it seems like it would be much nicer to just break the bleeder at each wheel and let the machine do the work?

Why do you want to power bleed? You can flush the system with denatured alcohol prior to filling with the new fluid.

Why do you want to power bleed? You can flush the system with denatured alcohol prior to filling with the new fluid.


What do you mean?


Before roadcoursing they highly suggest to replace/flush the brake fluid. To me the easiest way is to pressure bleed them.

Before going out and spending a lot of money on flushing your brake system with a new performance brake fluid I would suggest keeping with the Ford fluid. Many years ago when Ford came out with the Crown Victoria they were forced to re-engineer the brake fluid. What happened was the old ladies where left foot braking with the cars and instead of pulling the foot completely off the brake they would drag the brake which overheated the standard Ford fluid. We have found that the Ford fluid exceeds the dot 4 specifications and it is what we use in all of our race cars. All we do is make sure it is clean just like any other fluid would require.

Before going out and spending a lot of money on flushing your brake system with a new performance brake fluid I would suggest keeping with the Ford fluid. Many years ago when Ford came out with the Crown Victoria they were forced to re-engineer the brake fluid. What happened was the old ladies where left foot braking with the cars and instead of pulling the foot completely off the brake they would drag the brake which overheated the standard Ford fluid. We have found that the Ford fluid exceeds the dot 4 specifications and it is what we use in all of our race cars. All we do is make sure it is clean just like any other fluid would require.

Are you saying that I drive like an old lady? :eek:


:D

Are you saying that I drive like an old lady? :eek:


:D

If you leave your left foot on the brake while driving on the highway then I guess I am. :D :D :D

Are you saying that I drive like an old lady? :eek:


:D

Yeah ....the little old lady from Passadina...go grannie go...

Before going out and spending a lot of money on flushing your brake system with a new performance brake fluid I would suggest keeping with the Ford fluid. Many years ago when Ford came out with the Crown Victoria they were forced to re-engineer the brake fluid. What happened was the old ladies where left foot braking with the cars and instead of pulling the foot completely off the brake they would drag the brake which overheated the standard Ford fluid. We have found that the Ford fluid exceeds the dot 4 specifications and it is what we use in all of our race cars. All we do is make sure it is clean just like any other fluid would require.

Do you have the wet and dry specs of the fluid in these cars from the factory?

What do you mean?


Before roadcoursing they highly suggest to replace/flush the brake fluid. To me the easiest way is to pressure bleed them.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "easiest". I think gravity bleeding is "easiest"....simply open the bleeder and sit in a chair.

Now if you mean "fastest", that's another story.

Sounds like you don't need to flush the system....just put new fluid in...right?

For a street car pressure bleeding is probably okay. However, I would never use a pressure bleeder on one of our race cars. I would also never multiple pump (one pump only) during standard manual pump bleeding as it can aerate your fluid. I guess this is the anal part of me that I enforce on the employees of our company.

If you leave your left foot on the brake while driving on the highway then I guess I am. :D :D :D

I don't do that, but I have always been a 2 footed driver, even w/ an automatic.

Friends thought I was weird, but then again my friends here think I am weird anyway.:D

Do you have the wet and dry specs of the fluid in these cars from the factory?

In our owners manual it does say to use Ford Performance brake fluid.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "easiest". I think gravity bleeding is "easiest"....simply open the bleeder and sit in a chair.

Now if you mean "fastest", that's another story.

Sounds like you don't need to flush the system....just put new fluid in...right?

The track asks that you flush the system w/ new fluid.

For a street car pressure bleeding is probably okay. However, I would never use a pressure bleeder on one of our race cars. I would also never multiple pump (one pump only) during standard manual pump bleeding as it can aerate your fluid. I guess this is the anal part of me that I enforce on the employees of our company.

Since you sound like this is common practice and you race, I will take your advice. Thanks :D

The track asks that you flush the system w/ new fluid.

Semantics I'm sure. To me, flush means "clean out all traces of the old liquid", which would infer putting the denatured alcohol in. For their purposes, they mean just getting all the old fluid out and putting new fluid in...it's not necessary to remove the "trace" elements of old fluid. THe only time you'd need to do what I describe is if you were installing an INCOMPATIBLE fluid, such as some of the silicon-based fluids. Sorry for confusing you earlier.

Dave

Semantics I'm sure. To me, flush means "clean out all traces of the old liquid", which would infer putting the denatured alcohol in. For their purposes, they mean just getting all the old fluid out and putting new fluid in...it's not necessary to remove the "trace" elements of old fluid. THe only time you'd need to do what I describe is if you were installing an INCOMPATIBLE fluid, such as some of the silicon-based fluids. Sorry for confusing you earlier.

Dave


I'm easily confused, and what does Semantics mean?

I'm easily confused, and what does Semantics mean?

Use google hybrid boy. :cowtounge:

Much easier to bug you. :d

This came to me in a dream last night...:)


According to knowledgeable road racers, the stock fluid works fine with the stock pads, as the pads will cook before the fluid will boil. However, the use of aftermarket pads should be accompanied by a fluid change. The most recommended fluid seems to be Motul RBF 600 fluid. However, examine the notes below carefully, paying special attention to the comments for Ford Heavy Duty fluid.

The importance of moisture: The amount of moisture in brake fluid definitely affects its performance. The big problem is that brake fluid absorbs moisture quickly. SAE field tests have shown that the average one year old car has 2% moisture in the fluid. A random test of vehicles in the U.S. showed an average water content of 2.6% for vehicles with an average age of 8 years. And 25% of these vehicles had water content greater than 4%.

As water content in brake fluid increases over time, the boiling point decreases. Fluid with a reduced boiling point (or high water content) can create vapor by boiling in the caliper, or wheel cylinder. The result is sudden brake failure. And water in the brake fluid can contribute to corrosion of parts such as steel pistons and ABS modulators.

The end result is even though DOT 3 fluid is "rated" at greater than 401F, in the typical 3 to 4 year old car with 3 to 4% moisture content, it could boil under 300F.

Bottom line: Flush any brake fluid every year or so. If you go with a fluid which attracts moisture quicker, change it more often than that.

DOT 3 and DOT 4 are polyglycol-based fluids and can be mixed with each other. DOT 5.1 can also be mixed with DOT 3 and DOT 4, even though it is based on a different chemical and has about half the viscosity. If DOT 5.1 is specified for an ABS system, do not add or use any other fluid type. DOT 5 is silicone-based (not less than 70% by weight of a diorgano polysiloxane) and must not be mixed with or contaminated by DOT 3, DOT 4, or DOT 5.1.

Container: As stated by Baer, "plastic containers allow the fluid to absorb moisture from the air, essentially dropping it to its wet boiling point before ever being put in the car."


Mfg Spec Dry/Wet Boiling Point Can
ATE Super Blue Racing/

ATE TYP 200


DOT 4 536/392 metal ATE Super Blue Racing and ATE TYP 200 are the same brake fluid in two different colors (blue and amber, respectively). BMW recommends this brake fluid for their street cars because it, like Castrol LMA, absorbs moisture very slowly. The advantage over LMA is that ATE has a much better wet boiling point. You can put this stuff in your car and forget about it for a long time. An excellent choice for a weekend track car which also sees regular street duty.

Castrol LMA


DOT 3/4 446/311 plastic Castrol LMA ("Low Moisture Activity") is very good at rejecting moisture and may be kept in your brake system for a couple years.

Castrol SRF


DOT 4 590/518 metal Castrol SRF is a hyper-exotic and hyper-expensive ($80/liter) brake fluid. From Castrol: "Castrol SRF is less hygroscopic than conventional brake fluids - it absorbs less water in a given time. Unlike conventional glycol ether fluids, Castrol SRF reacts chemically with the absorbed water to reduce its adverse effects, thus preventing the fluid's high-temperature performance and safety margins from deteriorating as rapidly as they would otherwise do." From "Castrol SRF is simply the best fluid we have ever used. It has extremely high boiling points, both wet and dry, and holds up well under the adverse conditions of road racing or other extreme duty."

Ford Heavy Duty

(part # C6AZ-19542-AA)


DOT 3 550/290 metal Ford Heavy Duty DOT 3 is very inexpensive and is popular among racers because of its excellent dry boiling point. Considered by many to be the best-kept secret in brake fluids. It does absorb moisture quickly, though. Metal can. Recommended by Baer and Alcon. According to Hot Rods and Horsepower: "Ford Motor Company purchases [Castrol SRF] by the barrel, repackages it, and sells it as Ford Heavy Duty fluid to owners of heavy-duty trucks. Anyone may buy it from a Ford dealer under part number C6AZ-19542-AA." Although this rumor is often repeated on the 'Net, given the different specs between the two, this assertion seems questionable at best.

Ford High Performance
DOT 3 550/284 plastic I ordered the Ford Heavy Duty fluid above from my dealer. I was told that the part number had changed and that Ford "High Performance DOT 3 Motor Vehicle Brake Fluid" was the substitute. Given the differences in the title, part number, and the plastic can, I suspect that my dealer is just full of . . ., well, wrong. The 550/284 rating suggests it is repackaged Performance Friction fluid put in a plastic can. Thanks, Ford.

Motul Racing 600


DOT 4 585/421 plastic Motul Racing 600 is a very exotic and relatively expensive synthetic fluid with high wet and dry boiling points. It is not suitable for the street because it absorbs moisture quickly.

Performance Friction


DOT 4 550/284 metal Performance Friction High Performance DOT 3 has a good dry boiling point but poor wet boiling point. The cheaper Ford Heavy Duty DOT 3 in probably a better choice. In either case, change this fluid frequently due to the poor wet boiling point. $8 per 16 ozs.

AP Racing 550

DOT 3 550/284
AP Racing 600

DOT 3 572/284
Wilwood 570

DOT 3 570/284
Wilwood EXP600 Plus

DOT 4 633/417

I'm confused.... who's this "DOT" person, and why doesn't she like moisture??

I thought I already told you all that Bill.

I have DOT-5 in my Camaro. I installed it in 1987....no rust to date. :browsmiley:

The only part I have slight disagreement with is the comment that the pads will 'cook' before the fluid boils. The fluid boiling would be 'sudden', whereas cooking of the pads would take time. boiling fluid (although I've never experienced it) will result in a VERY spongy pedal...stopping distance would increase dramatically.

I had a rubber brake line snap on me once when stopping from 25 mph...and that scared me. I can't even imagine boiling fluid on a road course at 75 mph. :worried:

I keep seeing this... "It is not suitable for the street because it absorbs moisture quickly." and don't understand where this moisture would come from? condensation?

I keep seeing this... "It is not suitable for the street because it absorbs moisture quickly." and don't understand where this moisture would come from? condensation?

Sort of. It comes from humidity in the air. You know how there's a bit of air in the master cylinder above the fluid? Well, that air has moisture in it. The master cylinder is not pressurized, so air can flow in there and the humidity then results in moisture settling on top of the fluid and working it's way into the fluid.

I keep seeing this... "It is not suitable for the street because it absorbs moisture quickly." and don't understand where this moisture would come from? condensation?

Maybe it has something to do with the fact that most people with street cars never change the fluid . After long periods of time more moisture will be absorbed in a dot 4 RBF than a simple dot3 fluid due to it's propensity to do so.
Don't forget the reason for going with a RBF in the first place is because you will be tracking your car and want the higher boiling point. It is recomended that you change the fluid before each track event to ensure the best performance of that RBF so having it in your car should not be an issue unless of course you never change it as recomended.

Maybe it has something to do with the fact that most people with street cars never change the fluid . After long periods of time more moisture will be absorbed in a dot 4 RBF than a simple dot3 fluid due to it's propensity to do so.
Don't forget the reason for going with a RBF in the first place is because you will be tracking your car and want the higher boiling point. It is recomended that you change the fluid before each track event to ensure the best performance of that RBF so having it in your car should not be an issue unless of course you never change it as recomended.

Good point, thanks.

I have looked deeper into the Ford Performance fluid, but the temp ratings on the Motul are so much higher.

I only worried that it said 'not for street use', but I think the reason has to do with what you said...most people wouldn't change it. I will, so I am going w/ the Motul RBF 600 afterall.

I had thought of doing all the brake mods, lines, rotors, cooling kit, fluid change on Saturday but it is supposed to rain.:(

I had thought of doing all the brake mods, lines, rotors, cooling kit, fluid change on Saturday but it is supposed to rain.:(

You can do everything except put the new fluid in, I'd wait till the humidity is down.:simmadown:

Does changing the brake fluid to this HP stuff affect the clutch CSC bearing operation in anyway? I am sure you know that it runs off the same master cyclinder.

Does changing the brake fluid to this HP stuff affect the clutch CSC bearing operation in anyway? I am sure you know that it runs off the same master cyclinder.

I heard it makes any CSC whine go away. :badrazz:

Does changing the brake fluid to this HP stuff affect the clutch CSC bearing operation in anyway? I am sure you know that it runs off the same master cyclinder.

The fluids are compatable so it should be fine.

I heard it makes any CSC whine go away. :badrazz:

Orf deserves a major raspberry....we'll get him next time we see him. :fight:

Orf deserves a major raspberry....we'll get him next time we see him. :fight:

I deserve that, and then some. Mean old me, picking on poor little Rob.

I'll go back to my corner now.

I deserve that, and then some. Mean old me, picking on poor little Rob.

I'll go back to my corner now.

Ha...It's good for him. Builds character.

I deserve that, and then some. Mean old me, picking on poor little Rob.

I'll go back to my corner now.

.....as long as you come out for the next round.....ding ding ding.

I can't take it anymore. Now I will have to leave here too.

I am going over to the mini forums!

I can't take it anymore. Now I will have to leave here too.

I am going over to the mini forums!

Are you going to be like Bill and start http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/Juggling-1.gif3 different sites.

Are you going to be like Bill and start http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/Juggling-1.gif3 different sites.

No, I am not a post whore like him.

Now lets talk about the dam brake fluid. That's a topic that is riveting.:zzz:

I deserve that, and then some. Mean old me, picking on poor little Rob.

I'll go back to my corner now.

I think I spelled raspberry right. Hard to imagine eating anything that starts with "rasp"....yuk.

HTD

No, I am not a post whore like him.

Now lets talk about the dam brake fluid. That's a topic that is riveting.:zzz:

They have brake fluid at Hoover Dam? :bandit:

They have brake fluid at Hoover Dam? :bandit:

Dam brake fluid! I get it.




You card, you.

No, I am not a post whore like him.

Now lets talk about the dam brake fluid. That's a topic that is riveting.:zzz:

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc289/JoeG_09/Emoticon/oh_snap.gif

Good one Grabby!

You can do everything except put the new fluid in, I'd wait till the humidity is down.:simmadown:

I can't because I can't bleed it in my garage.

My garage is too small to do this job in, it will have to be done in the driveway.

I can't take it anymore. Now I will have to leave here too.

I am going over to the mini forums!

I don't think you would last long, no crap taken over there. No questionable pictures allowed over there. No haters allowed over there.
No whining allowed over there.





...that's why I'm here. http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AAA%20Smilies/tease.gif

I can't because I can't bleed it in my garage.

My garage is too small to do this job in, it will have to be done in the driveway.

Check !Wait till it's sunny then :orangehat:

Check !Wait till it's sunny then :orangehat:

It has rained on the weekend the last 3 weekends.http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AAA%20Smilies/cry.gif

I don't think you would last long, no crap taken over there. No questionable pictures allowed over there. No haters allowed over there.
No whining allowed over there.





...that's why I'm here. http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AAA%20Smilies/tease.gif

You have not changed a bit since you were a kid.:o

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/th_6e6203bb.jpg (http://s95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/?action=view&current=6e6203bb.flv)

You have not changed a bit since you were a kid.:o

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/th_6e6203bb.jpg (http://s95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/?action=view&current=6e6203bb.flv)

Rob that must be you when you were young....the Weinner mobile is grabber yellow. LOL

You have not changed a bit since you were a kid.:o

http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/th_6e6203bb.jpg (http://s95.photobucket.com/albums/l159/bitotigr/?action=view&current=6e6203bb.flv)

This is funny.

Co Pilot said that on Good Morning America this morning, Oscar Mayer release their last weiner mobile, it is a Mini Cooper and they call it "pig in a blanket". http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AAA%20Smilies/happy.gif


Really!

Sort of. It comes from humidity in the air. You know how there's a bit of air in the master cylinder above the fluid? Well, that air has moisture in it. The master cylinder is not pressurized, so air can flow in there and the humidity then results in moisture settling on top of the fluid and working it's way into the fluid.

Wow this has gotten very long and I haven’t even read the whole thing yet. The master cylinder will not let any moisture in if the cap is on correctly. The caps have a vent hole but the outside air is separated from the fluid by a bladder. The higher the boiling point on brake fluid the more quickly it will absorb water. Brake fluid attracts water so quickly that we recommend leaving the cap on the master cylinder and bottle of the fluid even during the bleeding process. I wouldn’t use brake fluid if the cap was off the bottle for more than 10-15 minutes even in Death Valley.

Wow this has gotten very long and I haven’t even read the whole thing yet. The master cylinder will not let any moisture in if the cap is on correctly. The caps have a vent hole but the outside air is separated from the fluid by a bladder. The higher the boiling point on brake fluid the more quickly it will absorb water. Brake fluid attracts water so quickly that we recommend leaving the cap on the master cylinder and bottle of the fluid even during the bleeding process. I wouldn’t use brake fluid if the cap was off the bottle for more than 10-15 minutes even in Death Valley.
+1 on the "don't use brake fluid if the cap isn't sealed". Once you break the seal, don't put it back on the shelf.

I know what you're saying about the cap being on correctly...but then why are so many people having trouble with their fluid leaking out onto the master cylinder? There is a path for the fluid somewhere in that thing...even though there should not be.

+1 on the "don't use brake fluid if the cap isn't sealed". Once you break the seal, don't put it back on the shelf.

I know what you're saying about the cap being on correctly...but then why are so many people having trouble with their fluid leaking out onto the master cylinder? There is a path for the fluid somewhere in that thing...even though there should not be.

I believe it is just that some of the caps simply don't fit right.

This is some good info, I didn't know it absorbed humidity that fast.

I will be more on top of this in the future...although it may take away from my posting time...hahaha.

I believe it is just that some of the caps simply don't fit right.



If a cap leaks a little, and most do seep a tad, just put the little neopreem washer in like this. Problem solved.

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/th_BrakeResvFix015.jpg (http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/BrakeResvFix015.jpg)
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/th_BrakeResvFix014.jpg (http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/BrakeResvFix014.jpg)
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/th_BrakeResvFix013.jpg (http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/BrakeResvFix013.jpg)
http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/th_BrakeResvFix012.jpg (http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x53/Grabrrr/Brake%20resv%20fix/BrakeResvFix012.jpg)

my friends here think I am weird anyway.:D
Yep...:bananahump-slvrathl

I believe it is just that some of the caps simply don't fit right.

This is some good info, I didn't know it absorbed humidity that fast.

I will be more on top of this in the future...although it may take away from my posting time...hahaha.
I don't recommend adding a dessicant bag inside your master cylinder. :thinkerg:

Yep...:bananahump-slvrathl

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AA%20SMILIES/gun.gif

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/AA%20SMILIES/gun.gif

I take it you are offended by that emote. I'm not so sure I can tell exactly what it is.

I've had my car on the track three times with the "stock" fluid in it. No fade yet. I haven't replaced the OEM pads yet either but will be soon. I'll be interested to see if the stopping goes up or down with the Hawks in place of OEM. Temp goes with stopping power so we'll see what the fluid does too. I have installed a FRPP brake cooling kit though. That may have something to do with my results.

A Ford Parts guy/racer dude told me to use Focus Fluid. It's supposed to be a higher boiling point. Right now I'll be sticking with the Ford recommended fluid for the GT500.

What do they use in the FR500C? I know that stuff works! I've seen them in action!

I found the article here is a part of it.

Here's the link for the whole article. http://www.stoptech.com/tech_info/wp_brakefluid_1a.shtml

Good article, George ...thanks!

I take it you are offended by that emote. I'm not so sure I can tell exactly what it is.

That is one of about 3, the other show them flipping off people. I don't see the need for them here?

I've had my car on the track three times with the "stock" fluid in it. No fade yet. I haven't replaced the OEM pads yet either but will be soon. I'll be interested to see if the stopping goes up or down with the Hawks in place of OEM. Temp goes with stopping power so we'll see what the fluid does too. I have installed a FRPP brake cooling kit though. That may have something to do with my results.

A Ford Parts guy/racer dude told me to use Focus Fluid. It's supposed to be a higher boiling point. Right now I'll be sticking with the Ford recommended fluid for the GT500.

What do they use in the FR500C? I know that stuff works! I've seen them in action!


This is the highest quality fluid Ford has... it is the Motorcraft High Performance fluid. All the other Performance Fluids Ford had now cross over to this. It is rated to 500 dry/ 284 wet boiling points.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/Other%20mods/hghperfdot3bkfld.jpg

Motul 600, is equal in all aspects of formulation, but has a rating of 585/421 respectively.

This is the highest quality fluid Ford has... it is the Motorcraft High Performance fluid. All the other Performance Fluids Ford had now cross over to this. It is rated to 500 dry/ 284 wet boiling points.

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb76/FastestShelby/Other%20mods/hghperfdot3bkfld.jpg

Motul 600, is equal in all aspects of formulation, but has a rating of 585/421 respectively.

I respect that respectivly too!:)

Dave is making his own in the "woodshop." (http://www.ucm.es/info/gsolfa/imagenes/orellana_Organic_and_Inorganic_Synthesis_Laborator y.jpg) :lol:

That is one of about 3, the other show them flipping off people. I don't see the need for them here?

:thefinger:

:fu:

:nofu:



:badrazz:



(just kidding Beachboy!! :kiss: )

Dave is making his own in the "woodshop." (http://www.ucm.es/info/gsolfa/imagenes/orellana_Organic_and_Inorganic_Synthesis_Laborator y.jpg) :lol:

Looks more like a chem factory!

Dave is making his own in the "woodshop." (http://www.ucm.es/info/gsolfa/imagenes/orellana_Organic_and_Inorganic_Synthesis_Laborator y.jpg) :lol:

OMG Dan, that's funny. takes me back. When I started college, I was a ChemE major. In lab on the first day, I looked at the ceiling and saw all these black circles about 2" in diameter. I asked the professor what they were. He said, don't worry, we'll talk about that later.

About a month later I was making salycilic acid (aspirin) and there was a step where we had to heat a liquid in a test tube to exactly a certain temp. I got it about 2 degrees to hot and............fffffffffffffflllllllllllammmmo...a huge black spot on the ceiling. 1815

I asked the professor why he didn't warn us about that earlier or clue me in when I asked a month ago. He said "you tend to remember things better when you learn them the hard way". 1816

Here I am 30 years later...and I still remember.

Dave

OMG Dan, that's funny. takes me back. When I started college, I was a ChemE major. In lab on the first day, I looked at the ceiling and saw all these black circles about 2" in diameter. I asked the professor what they were. He said, don't worry, we'll talk about that later.

About a month later I was making salycilic acid (aspirin) and there was a step where we had to heat a liquid in a test tube to exactly a certain temp. I got it about 2 degrees to hot and............fffffffffffffflllllllllllammmmo...a huge black spot on the ceiling. 1815

I asked the professor why he didn't warn us about that earlier or clue me in when I asked a month ago. He said "you tend to remember things better when you learn them the hard way". 1816

Here I am 30 years later...and I still remember.

Dave


Did your eyebrows ever grow back??


http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb254/Badood/EXPLOSION.gif

:lol:

shades of Adam Savage on Mythbusters :)

:lol:

shades of Adam Savage on Mythbusters :)

Exactly!! :flame:

Exactly!! :flame:

...you look al fired up there Joegie :)

...you look al fired up there Joegie :)

He thinks he's hot stuff around here....

He thinks he's hot stuff around here....

No, that's you.:cowtounge:

No, that's you.:cowtounge:

I aint hot stuff anywhere. :)

He thinks he's hot stuff around here....

This is how Joe cools off ! He really is a trouble maker.
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/spoiler.jpg

This is how Joe cools off ! He really is a trouble maker.
http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z234/svtbird91/emoticons/spoiler.jpg

Is he moving up or down? :rolleyes: :lol:

Anyone tried one of the Motive brake bleeders before?

Anyone try using the Motive bleeder? I just ordered one after seeing the good reviews to do a flush of my brakes and add DOT 4 fluid.

http://www.lpiracing.com/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=62181

Anyone try using the Motive bleeder? I just ordered one after seeing the good reviews to do a flush of my brakes and add DOT 4 fluid.

http://www.lpiracing.com/viewPrd.asp?idproduct=62181

yea i have it. works great. got the catch can as well. i use two diff color fluids and change it every six months. changing color helps to know when its all out from each line to the wheel. make sure the tank hose is good and tight at its middle connection. i only go to about 10psi. thats plenty to bleed and change.

Good article, George ...thanks!
Now THAT was an excellent article on brake fluid. I had my dealer replace my brake fluid with stock recommendation. My Shelby has 9k and fluids were 4 years old. I think I'll replace annually after reading the arcticle. Inexpensive insurance, indeed.